Author Topic: Time to get medieval with Averies Recycling?!  (Read 44184 times)

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Offline Muggins

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Re: Time to get medieval with Averies Recycling?!
« Reply #80 on: September 20, 2014, 08:45:17 AM »
For what it's worth there will be an inquiry into the Averies fire (according to BBC West news this morning) reporting in January.  Whether it'll deliver anything worthwhile is another matter of course.

From Flic:

A second motion, put forward by Labour's Mark Dempsey, for a full inquiry to call Averies, the authority and the Environment Agency and "hold them to account” was withdrawn at the meeting this evening.

Councillor Dale Heenan said: “"The Averies Waste Fire has finally been put out after 8 weeks, great. Now is the time for action, and I believe this site near Greenbridge is not appropriate for waste storage because it is so near to residential properties.

“I live in Coleview and was affected by the smoke and burning smell as it hung throughout the day, and received many complaints from neighbours and the residents I represent in Coleview, Covingham and Nythe.

“We need action, not talk so the unanimous cross party vote by Councillors to support the call by Cllr John Haines of Stratton and I will mean there is an investigation into closing down the Averies site, and there will be a public review of the independent investigation into the fire which is already taking place.

“The Labour party alternative for a four month public enquiry to dissect the last eight weeks was withdrawn without debate so common sense prevailed."

Um, maybe it will be watered down.  If they do not dissect the last eight weeks, then we'll never get to the bottom of which agency pushed to have the stuff brought to the Park and ride, and in that weird decision I think lies the rub and the truth of what was going on.

Maybe there should be two inquiries -

1. How come it was allowed to happen in the first place and
2. What happened when it did.

Both need looking at - the one being the safety net of the other.  So no it's not common sense prevailing
it's cover up time again.
Oi! Listen mush. Old eyes, remember? I’ve been around the block a few times. More than a few. They’ve knocked down the blocks I’ve been around and rebuilt them as bigger blocks. Super blocks. And I’ve been round them as well.  The Doctor (Night Terrors)

Offline Spunkymonkey

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Re: Time to get medieval with Averies Recycling?!
« Reply #81 on: September 20, 2014, 08:38:13 PM »
Councillor Dale Heenan said: “"The Averies Waste Fire has finally been put out after 8 weeks, great. Now is the time for action, and I believe this site near Greenbridge is not appropriate for waste storage because it is so near to residential properties...................

.......... The Labour party alternative for a four month public enquiry to dissect the last eight weeks was withdrawn without debate so common sense prevailed."

and from the Adver ......

Quote
Bernie Brannan, who chaired the group which co-ordinated the response to the fire, said: “There will be a full debrief looking at our response to the incident so this is assessed and we can learn lessons and also share best practice, as appropriate.

“The multi-agency debrief will be an independent process, with an external facilitator via the Local Resilience Forum, and is anticipated to start next month."


If there isn't an enquiry, then the debrief must be made public. Not to do so would be a crime against democracy.

Offline Tobes

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Re: Time to get medieval with Averies Recycling?!
« Reply #82 on: September 20, 2014, 11:41:39 PM »
At least there's some good news and an opportunity to recognise our council at least attempting to do the right thing:

Quote
At a full council meeting on Thursday, a motion to investigate all avenues which might enable the depot to be closed was passed unanimously.

Coun David Renard (Con, Haydon Wick), the council leader, will now turn put pressure on the Environment Agency (EA) in the hope it can shut Averies’ site down.

“The Environment Agency have the legal responsibility for the monitoring of them,” said Coun Renard.

“We can put pressure on them to say, if they’re in Swindon, we want them to use the full extent of their powers to manage them properly.

“We have no legal role in this other than to apply pressure. I don’t think we can do much more than that.
I do not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it - [attributed to] Voltaire... 'Entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessita' - William of Occam.... 'You have a right to feel offended, but just cos you are offended doesn't mean you are right'

Offline Phil Chitty

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Re: Time to get medieval with Averies Recycling?!
« Reply #83 on: September 21, 2014, 12:20:08 PM »
Absolutely Tobes, the proper response is for the Environment Agengy to hold their own enquiry, to then use the full powers they have against both the Corporate body Averies and then the directors.

On this matter Cllr Renard is absolutely correct. The only way for the Council to become involved is to pressurise the EA and make them understand that we will not tolerate them allowing Swindon to become a dumping ground.

I for one suspect that Cllr Dempsey may be looking towards May next year with his posturing.

Offline Spunkymonkey

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Re: Time to get medieval with Averies Recycling?!
« Reply #84 on: September 21, 2014, 02:39:19 PM »
On this matter Cllr Renard is absolutely correct. The only way for the Council to become involved is to pressurise the EA and make them understand that we will not tolerate them allowing Swindon to become a dumping ground.

SBC can't entirely wipe their hands of this though can they. Who gave planning permission for the site? Who chaired the GOLD disaster management team or whatever they call themselves?

I read an opinion somewhere that the location was appropriate when the site was opened, but is no longer so now that development has grown up around it. Who agreed to the original site and who agreed to the subsequent development?

Is David Renard saying that the site is not suitable full stop or is he saying that Averies management of the facility is entirely to blame? If it is former then the planners are partly to blame. If it is the latter, it would presumably be acceptable for a different operator to take over the site.

I agree that Mark Dempsey is trying maximise political point scoring with a view to the next election, but he is councillor for Walcot and many of his constituents were badly affected by the smoke and fumes. I would be surprised if he wasn't posturing under the circumstances.

Offline Muggins

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Re: Time to get medieval with Averies Recycling?!
« Reply #85 on: September 21, 2014, 05:58:02 PM »
I gave a clear report on how Mark Dempsey became involved in our part of the debacle when they (SBC)said they (Averies ) would be bring the stuff to the park and ride.  I know this because it was me that messaged him and asked him to help, after I had messaged our MP. See that posting although I can't find it now, it's here somewhere.

You could call it posturing, but that would be unfair, seeing the amount of effort he put in then and since to get something done.  I'm not saying others didn't get involved afterwards, and pretty damn quick after they came to or saw the strength of feelings at the Demo and meeting - over the two days many of them were hostile to our protest and I have about 60 witnesses to that. 

It was the meeting that called for the Enquiry, obviously followed pretty quickly by the guy mentioned in the Adver - although he could have been at the meeting.  You get a whole different picture when you are in the front line so to speak.

SBC does need to be part of this enquiry - planning permission was 'historic' it was reported to one of our community meetings this week that the scarp yard was there pre-development and we are talking a long time ago.  I believe prior to scrapyard it was either the abattoir site or next to it.  Development being Greenbridge and the rest of the new housing out that way.   

The decision to bring it to the park and ride, was made by the GOLD panel/whatever sort of group it is.  That included the Borough, the Borough solicitor chaired it (subject of another posting or two) And again - at our meeting were the SBC Environmental health person, they had been doing the air monitoring or at least involved in it - she gave a report on it at the meeting, but by that time no one had much faith in their words. The Deputy Leader of the council was there, in fact all the top table was SBC except two Environment agency chaps and a fireman. Of course they all buck shoved responsibility onto the environment agency, but they all knew each other well enough and I believe that it is probably SBC that call and implement the GOLD decisions. We should know via the enquiry what went on in the run up to that - the fire had been burning then the best part of two months.

All of that GOLD thing should be inquired into - if that is the best we have in the event of a disaster God help us.

Our MP's response to my message - too late to help really - (not blaming him, I don't know his diary, he could have been anywhere and by that time all I was on my way over to the Demo) his message was:

"Hi - I have just seen.  From what I can see, it would be wood, metal and cardboard, all not smouldering.  That said, I don't see why the Environment Agency doesn't just force Averies insurance to pay for the clearance to Hills who have said they will take it."

There you go, he knew that information whilst SBC was turning on the traffic lights and clearing the site to let Averies in.

I think that's the question to which we need an answer - along with why didn't SBC help the Environment Agency force Averies, instead of making a place available?

And why was a Park and ride, in another built up area, thought suitable.

No there are several things that SBC need to ask themselves about this.   
Oi! Listen mush. Old eyes, remember? I’ve been around the block a few times. More than a few. They’ve knocked down the blocks I’ve been around and rebuilt them as bigger blocks. Super blocks. And I’ve been round them as well.  The Doctor (Night Terrors)

Offline Tobes

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Re: Time to get medieval with Averies Recycling?!
« Reply #86 on: September 21, 2014, 07:33:44 PM »
I think this is an ideal opportunity for both sides to work together, openly.

Its revealing that the council cannot state categorically that it can take decisive action.

This is an indication of how neutered our council actually is - and a reminder why devolved power is something which needs to happen right the way across the board in the UK. If a local council cant reflect the interests and opinions of its local electorate on matters so immediate to them as planning and licensing effecting farces like this, Regents shared space, and The Brunel, then no wonder people constantly assume the worst of their councillors inability to effect REAL change or act honestly in their interests. That cynicism explains the appalling local turn-outs and the complete distrust and disengagement which gets worse year-on-year.

I've disagreed with aspects of Dempsey's political stance in the past, as I have the views and opinions of some of Renard's colleagues. However, regarding this subject, I wish them both the best of luck - for all our sakes.

Perhaps this could tie-in with something I've floated to Better Swindon - greater clarity on behalf of all candidates and councillors as to what they actually can and can't do locally. It benefits neither them nor their electorate to either wash their hands over things they can influence, or to falsely claim it over things which are decided by central government or national legislation and licensing.

I do not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it - [attributed to] Voltaire... 'Entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessita' - William of Occam.... 'You have a right to feel offended, but just cos you are offended doesn't mean you are right'

Offline Spunkymonkey

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Re: Time to get medieval with Averies Recycling?!
« Reply #87 on: September 21, 2014, 07:43:52 PM »
This is an indication of how neutered our council actually is - and a reminder why devolved power is something which needs to happen right the way across the board in the UK.

Are you saying that you have sufficient confidence in our local councillors, that you would be happy to give them more power?

Offline Muggins

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Re: Time to get medieval with Averies Recycling?!
« Reply #88 on: September 21, 2014, 08:09:34 PM »
Tbes Quote: "Perhaps this could tie-in with something I've floated to Better Swindon - greater clarity on behalf of all candidates and councillors as to what they actually can and can't do locally. It benefits neither them nor their electorate to either wash their hands over things they can influence, or to falsely claim it over things which are decided by central government or national legislation and licensing."

It is also a question of what they want to admit to being able to do. Prior to this Cllr Renard was denying any responsibility for any decision made regarding the fire.  It took me to point out to him that the Park and Ride land belongs to SBC that they had it in their power to deny Averies access or not even point it them in its direction the first place. To be honest, I don't think from his responses that he was fully aware of everything that was going on.  I agree Tobes, that we need to know, that they know, what they are responsible for and what not!

In whatever dealing I have with them about anything, I wonder how aware they are of their own plans and policies. That's what worries me about all those redundancies and having fewer Cllrs to cope with a much larger town. Also how dedicated are they in the first place.  I am repeatedly telling officers that I know how difficult things are for them. But I still tell them what we need and sometimes add how they can get it for us, providing they are listening of course.  Not that we get much.

There is no doubt in my mind that when they attended that meeting on Penhill, they got a shock.

Oi! Listen mush. Old eyes, remember? I’ve been around the block a few times. More than a few. They’ve knocked down the blocks I’ve been around and rebuilt them as bigger blocks. Super blocks. And I’ve been round them as well.  The Doctor (Night Terrors)

Offline Spunkymonkey

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Re: Time to get medieval with Averies Recycling?!
« Reply #89 on: October 09, 2014, 10:07:36 PM »
Averies are in trouble again:-

http://www.swindonadvertiser.co.uk/news/11522947.Waste_company_is_in_hot_water_again/

Offline Terry Reynolds

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Re: Time to get medieval with Averies Recycling?!
« Reply #90 on: October 11, 2014, 10:24:41 AM »
There is a application for a licence for 8 vehicles by 'swindon reclamation ltd' of 1 marshgate, in the adver today. is this the same place that was burnt to a cinder, if so then the application needs to be challenged and have thrown out..

Offline Phil Chitty

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Re: Time to get medieval with Averies Recycling?!
« Reply #91 on: November 25, 2014, 11:17:18 AM »
http://www.swindonadvertiser.co.uk/news/11622871.Council_could_face___2m_Swindon_Skips_site_clean_up_bill/

Change could for will.

Swindon Skips Ltd has already gone bust - so hands in your pockets chaps.

Lee Averies has taken money from people to dispose of their rubbish - what he hasn't burnt he's left us all to pay to have cleaned up.

He has also registered a new company, (they do not YET have a waste licence) Zero Waste Southern Ltd at an address in Ermin Street.

He does own Calne Aggregates and Calne Aggregate holdings, both of whom do have waste licences.


Offline Outoftowner

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Re: Time to get medieval with Averies Recycling?!
« Reply #92 on: November 25, 2014, 11:26:34 AM »
Terry:

The current Directors of Swindon Reclamation Ltd are, Ms Valerie Averies and David James Averies. Mr Lee Averies retired his Directorship on 9th September 2010. ( So not linked at all then?)
What's it all about?

Offline Phil Chitty

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Re: Time to get medieval with Averies Recycling?!
« Reply #93 on: November 25, 2014, 11:40:54 AM »
The same David and Valerie that owned 80% of Averies Recycling (Swindon) Ltd.

Offline Terry Reynolds

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Re: Time to get medieval with Averies Recycling?!
« Reply #94 on: November 25, 2014, 12:01:07 PM »
oot was that before or after the fire, and who had their mits in the sites at cheney manor and at w\bassett....??

Offline Phil Chitty

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Re: Time to get medieval with Averies Recycling?!
« Reply #95 on: November 25, 2014, 12:25:07 PM »
Cheyney Manor - company was owned by Lee Averies

Offline Phil Chitty

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Re: Time to get medieval with Averies Recycling?!
« Reply #96 on: November 25, 2014, 12:29:18 PM »
http://www.thetelegraphandargus.co.uk/news/11334740.Arson_fears_after_Calne_waste_site_blazes/

Seems Lee Averies and fires go hand in hand!!!

Offline Geoff Reid

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Re: Time to get medieval with Averies Recycling?!
« Reply #97 on: November 25, 2014, 01:46:04 PM »
A veritable 'poster boy' for the Perkinesque "Swindon Is The Place To Do Business" mantra.

Offline Muggins

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Re: Time to get medieval with Averies Recycling?!
« Reply #98 on: November 25, 2014, 08:39:04 PM »
Expect another big bonfire in the next couple of weeks! 

Oi! Listen mush. Old eyes, remember? I’ve been around the block a few times. More than a few. They’ve knocked down the blocks I’ve been around and rebuilt them as bigger blocks. Super blocks. And I’ve been round them as well.  The Doctor (Night Terrors)

Offline the gorgon

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Re: Time to get medieval with Averies Recycling?!
« Reply #99 on: November 26, 2014, 06:28:24 PM »
One would hope Averies would be locked up like these two http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-south-west-wales-23463210