Author Topic: No Buyers For New Croft-Type Schools  (Read 35436 times)

0 Members and 46 Guests are viewing this topic.

Offline jennyb

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1813
  • Gender: Female
  • Kareen
Re: No Buyers For New Croft-Type Schools
« Reply #20 on: September 13, 2013, 08:09:03 AM »
Irrespective of who stands where under what colour rosette, red , blue, yellow, white ,tartan or polka dot...

Is it the role of a local authority and an elected chamber to risk tax payer funds on business ventures?

Does a local authority or an elected chamber have the skills to compete against commercial businesses in the private sector?

Does a local authority or an elected chamber have the obligation to demonstrate openly and transparently how, when and by whom any such decisions were made to risk tax payers funds on any such ventures?

Does a local authority or an elected chamber have the obligation to demonstrate openly and transparently the opportunity cost of any such ventures?
It takes wisdom to know what you know and wisdom to know what you don't know and when to call in those who do. Often the people who do know will advise that evidence and research are very helpful when making decisions. Who knows it might even save a bit of money.

Offline Richard Symonds

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4024
Re: No Buyers For New Croft-Type Schools
« Reply #21 on: September 13, 2013, 09:13:31 PM »

Is it the role of a local authority and an elected chamber to risk tax payer funds on business ventures?

No no and no again

Does a local authority or an elected chamber have the skills to compete against commercial businesses in the private sector?

Generally no but there are the odd exceptions non of which apply to Swindon

Does a local authority or an elected chamber have the obligation to demonstrate openly and transparently how, when and by whom any such decisions were made to risk tax payers funds on any such ventures?

Yes, but you would be forgiven to believe that for the last ten years the administration in Swindon believes otherwise.

Does a local authority or an elected chamber have the obligation to demonstrate openly and transparently the opportunity cost of any such ventures?

Yes, and they should be criminally liable if they do not do so and it goes wrong. 

Had Bluh been aware of a potential prosecution for the recovery of the costs of Wi-fi he would have stopped it!


All public servants need to act responsibly with the money in their care.  If they do not and it can proven they acted with criminal negligence then they should be available for prosecution to the extent of their personal assets.  Then and only then could we achieve the responsible action we expect from our public servants be they Officers of the Council or Members of the Council.

It still remains to be seen as what will happen over Wi-fi and the longer it goes on the more the s*** sticks even by association.  We have not heard the end of that by a long chalk! 

And maybe Class Solutions is yet another example, you decide!
All my posts are my own opinion and do not represent any political organization or group

Offline Mart

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5249
  • Where's my cow?
Re: No Buyers For New Croft-Type Schools
« Reply #22 on: September 15, 2013, 10:48:03 AM »
I have.

Based on the sh1t sticks by association model. Also the timeline and activities.

We are going to do this.

It is the right thing to do.

We have consulted.

It is cheap as chips.

It is innovative.

Oh shit, it's all gone wrong.

It's not our fault.

It's your fault because you talked it down.

What money?

What's that shiny thing over there? Ooh pretty, want one ......
Sometimes I think you have to march right in and demand your rights, even if you don’t know what your rights are, or who the person is you’re talking to. Then, on the way out, slam the door.

Offline Richard Symonds

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4024
Re: No Buyers For New Croft-Type Schools
« Reply #23 on: September 15, 2013, 01:04:11 PM »
Oh Mart you do have a habit of encapsulating what the rest of really want to say in the most amusing way!!

You should stand as an Independent Councillor you have so much to offer.

I know we have had this conversation before, but please think it over again.

The administration would not know how to respond to you and it would make Council so much more lively.
All my posts are my own opinion and do not represent any political organization or group

Offline jennyb

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1813
  • Gender: Female
  • Kareen
Re: No Buyers For New Croft-Type Schools
« Reply #24 on: September 15, 2013, 01:48:27 PM »
Search google for modular schools and there are umpteen examples of providers and actual schools which have been delivered and are in progress. Leeds City Council is one area in which a bit of work is going on.

http://www.education.gov.uk/schools/adminandfinance/schoolscapital/buildingsanddesign/baseline?page=2 provides 2012 Government guidance on School Building.

Try as I might, I couldn't find any mention of Class Solutions.
It takes wisdom to know what you know and wisdom to know what you don't know and when to call in those who do. Often the people who do know will advise that evidence and research are very helpful when making decisions. Who knows it might even save a bit of money.

Offline jennyb

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1813
  • Gender: Female
  • Kareen
Re: No Buyers For New Croft-Type Schools
« Reply #25 on: September 15, 2013, 02:12:13 PM »
Search google for modular schools and there are umpteen examples of providers and actual schools which have been delivered and are in progress. Leeds City Council is one area in which a bit of work is going on.

http://www.education.gov.uk/schools/adminandfinance/schoolscapital/buildingsanddesign/baseline?page=2 provides 2012 Government guidance on School Building.

Try as I might, I couldn't find any mention of Class Solutions.


The Class Solutions Architect from SBC was a speaker at the October 2011 forum where this 'venture' was unveiled accompanied by the tax payer funded marketing blurb. http://www.cityandfinancial.com/conference/ppp_schools_2

Also check the UK Schools Building Procurement forum http://www.eb-forum.co.uk/how-it-works.php

It has quotes from 2012 attendees and the date of the next meeting in October 2013. Can't see any mention of SBC or SCS or Class Solutions in any of it.
It takes wisdom to know what you know and wisdom to know what you don't know and when to call in those who do. Often the people who do know will advise that evidence and research are very helpful when making decisions. Who knows it might even save a bit of money.

Offline Richard Symonds

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4024
Re: No Buyers For New Croft-Type Schools
« Reply #26 on: September 15, 2013, 02:19:24 PM »
[The Class Solutions Architect from SBC was a speaker at the October 2011 forum where this 'venture' was unveiled accompanied by the tax payer funded marketing blurb. http://www.cityandfinancial.com/conference/ppp_schools_2

Also check the UK Schools Building Procurement forum http://www.eb-forum.co.uk/how-it-works.php

It has quotes from 2012 attendees and the date of the next meeting in October 2013. Can't see any mention of SBC or SCS or Class Solutions in any of it.


That's because it has been very quietly dropped and they hope it will go away just like Wi-fi. 

Meanwhile you local residents are saddled with the design and a school that appears to be surplus to requirements.

Any idea of the intake this year and where they live?
All my posts are my own opinion and do not represent any political organization or group

Offline jennyb

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1813
  • Gender: Female
  • Kareen
Re: No Buyers For New Croft-Type Schools
« Reply #27 on: September 15, 2013, 02:40:30 PM »
The admissions guide for 2014-2015 is in the public domain. 

http://www.swindon.gov.uk/el/Education%20Document%20Library/Information%20-%20Admissions%20-%20Primary%20Admissions%20Guide%202014-15.pdf

It includes numbers at each school and broadly where they come from.

It also includes details of schools which Cabinet has approved for opening in September 2014. There would seem to be something missing... but perhaps I am just being thick...

Will have to read it in more detail when I have a moment.

As to the rest, the Planning Committee set a clear obligation on the LA as to the management and monitoring of a 420 pupil school opening on a phased implementation over 7 years.
It takes wisdom to know what you know and wisdom to know what you don't know and when to call in those who do. Often the people who do know will advise that evidence and research are very helpful when making decisions. Who knows it might even save a bit of money.

Offline jennyb

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1813
  • Gender: Female
  • Kareen
Re: No Buyers For New Croft-Type Schools
« Reply #28 on: October 06, 2013, 11:21:20 AM »
Drove past the Haydon Leigh School yesterday.

It is in the process of being expanded from a 2fe ( 420 pupil) to a 3fe (630 pupil) primary school.

The extension looks pretty solid...No sign of rows of roofs..Not a Class Solutions jobbie then? 

If  this 'cheap' design isn't even being used within the Borough has the Class Solutions Leviathon at the Croft become another member of the SBC White Elephant Club of failed business ventures?
It takes wisdom to know what you know and wisdom to know what you don't know and when to call in those who do. Often the people who do know will advise that evidence and research are very helpful when making decisions. Who knows it might even save a bit of money.

Offline Mickraker

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 782
  • Strawberry Fields Forever!
Re: No Buyers For New Croft-Type Schools
« Reply #29 on: October 06, 2013, 12:10:42 PM »
Primary schools for 500 pupils with pitched roofs above the entrance and main hall - been there seen that done it....... so it could be it is not unique or a first  :-\

http://www.yorkon.co.uk/kilbride-primary-school.html
My non aggresive posts are my own opinion and represent me, myself and I only!

Offline Richard Symonds

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4024
Re: No Buyers For New Croft-Type Schools
« Reply #30 on: October 06, 2013, 01:56:19 PM »
If  this 'cheap' design isn't even being used within the Borough has the Class Solutions Leviathon at the Croft become another member of the SBC White Elephant Club of failed business ventures?

Was it ever anything other than a 'White Elephant' Jenny B?

But more importantly has the Council learnt its lesson?
All my posts are my own opinion and do not represent any political organization or group

Offline Outoftowner

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1632
  • Gender: Male
  • Hello !
Re: No Buyers For New Croft-Type Schools
« Reply #31 on: October 06, 2013, 03:01:58 PM »
Quote
But more importantly has the Council learnt its lesson?

No Richard. We still have the world's first, vibrant, innovative, Wroughton "A", Photo-Voltaic Power Station, whoops forgot the pylons and the Biomass energy producing, in town, smoke stack, that will consume more timber per year than the UK can produce, shambles to come.  :coffee:
What's it all about?

Offline jennyb

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1813
  • Gender: Female
  • Kareen
Re: No Buyers For New Croft-Type Schools
« Reply #32 on: October 06, 2013, 03:49:55 PM »
Primary schools for 500 pupils with pitched roofs above the entrance and main hall - been there seen that done it....... so it could be it is not unique or a first  :-\

http://www.yorkon.co.uk/kilbride-primary-school.html


Perhaps if whoever is behind Class Solutions ... We know Cllr Foley just loved the design... Could it be she?.. Had done their homework ... This white elephant would not be there as a gigantic reminder of the arrogance of those in place to serve the public.
It takes wisdom to know what you know and wisdom to know what you don't know and when to call in those who do. Often the people who do know will advise that evidence and research are very helpful when making decisions. Who knows it might even save a bit of money.

Offline jennyb

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1813
  • Gender: Female
  • Kareen
Re: No Buyers For New Croft-Type Schools
« Reply #33 on: October 06, 2013, 04:04:47 PM »
And... Cllr Foley,as head of Children's Services , would not have to be held accountable for borrowing money to build schools where they were needed in the 1st place..

Now where is that primary school for North Swindon?
It takes wisdom to know what you know and wisdom to know what you don't know and when to call in those who do. Often the people who do know will advise that evidence and research are very helpful when making decisions. Who knows it might even save a bit of money.

Offline Richard Symonds

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4024
Re: No Buyers For New Croft-Type Schools
« Reply #34 on: October 06, 2013, 04:06:19 PM »
Perhaps if whoever is behind Class Solutions ... We know Cllr Foley just loved the design... Could it be she?

Has Fionuola Foley actually invested some of her own money in this pRoject then?

or is it more a case of investing ours?
All my posts are my own opinion and do not represent any political organization or group

Offline jennyb

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1813
  • Gender: Female
  • Kareen
Re: No Buyers For New Croft-Type Schools
« Reply #35 on: October 06, 2013, 04:12:59 PM »
Perhaps if whoever is behind Class Solutions ... We know Cllr Foley just loved the design... Could it be she?

Has Fionuola Foley actually invested some of her own money in this pRoject then?

or is it more a case of investing ours?

Can't think anyone would have been gullible enough to risk their own money on this... Just like wifi
..

In my opinion, if the design had been good and cost effective it would have been a fully fledged commercial venture managed by people in the real world.

I would speculate that every penny of this nonsensical project was funded by tax payers money.   


Swindon deserves better than this.

It takes wisdom to know what you know and wisdom to know what you don't know and when to call in those who do. Often the people who do know will advise that evidence and research are very helpful when making decisions. Who knows it might even save a bit of money.

Offline jennyb

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1813
  • Gender: Female
  • Kareen
Has a Croft-Type School been imposed on Even Swindon?
« Reply #36 on: October 11, 2013, 03:08:27 PM »
Just reading back on stuff...

Wasn't Even Swindon supposed to have a 1Fe extension?

Wasn't Class Solutions proposed?

Seem to recall that Cllr Moffat asked for a proper building on site... in a Scrutiny meeting if I recall correctly?

Does anyone know what's being built and who is the builder?

Because if it is Class Solutions it should be straightforward to check the costs and the build time ?

Surely....
It takes wisdom to know what you know and wisdom to know what you don't know and when to call in those who do. Often the people who do know will advise that evidence and research are very helpful when making decisions. Who knows it might even save a bit of money.

Offline jennyb

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1813
  • Gender: Female
  • Kareen
Re: No Buyers For New Croft-Type Schools .. not even in North Swindon?
« Reply #37 on: April 01, 2014, 03:30:49 PM »


http://www.swindonadvertiser.co.uk/news/11115206.Timetable_for_Tadpole_Farm_school_takes_shape/

Quite how a school can be so desperately needed when there are so many officers remunerated to satisfy the statutory need to plan for and provide school places is plain ridiculous.

Putting that aside for the moment...

http://www.swindonadvertiser.co.uk/news/11115206.Timetable_for_Tadpole_Farm_school_takes_shape/

Having looked at the planning application for this ( whenever it is built) it is not Class Solutions.

Has this flagship design sunk without further trace?

Has anyone, anywhere shown an interest?

Lessons learned?

Kareen

It takes wisdom to know what you know and wisdom to know what you don't know and when to call in those who do. Often the people who do know will advise that evidence and research are very helpful when making decisions. Who knows it might even save a bit of money.

Offline Muggins

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8535
Re: No Buyers For New Croft-Type Schools
« Reply #38 on: April 01, 2014, 06:18:28 PM »
Ref. Even Swindon, I haven't really followed the plot so far, but know it's now a pile of rubble and we can have daily pics if you like - family home is 4 doors from it.

It's not being rebuilt as a school - that was built quite a few years back a the end of Bruce Street, on a greenfield site.  It will be housing.
Oi! Listen mush. Old eyes, remember? I’ve been around the block a few times. More than a few. They’ve knocked down the blocks I’ve been around and rebuilt them as bigger blocks. Super blocks. And I’ve been round them as well.  The Doctor (Night Terrors)

Offline jennyb

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1813
  • Gender: Female
  • Kareen
Re: No Buyers For New Croft-Type Schools
« Reply #39 on: April 02, 2014, 08:16:18 AM »
Ref. Even Swindon, I haven't really followed the plot so far, but know it's now a pile of rubble and we can have daily pics if you like - family home is 4 doors from it.

It's not being rebuilt as a school - that was built quite a few years back a the end of Bruce Street, on a greenfield site.  It will be housing.

M,

Not sure what you are getting at here.....

Kareen
It takes wisdom to know what you know and wisdom to know what you don't know and when to call in those who do. Often the people who do know will advise that evidence and research are very helpful when making decisions. Who knows it might even save a bit of money.