Author Topic: Bad news, and Robert Buckland MP is part of it  (Read 21012 times)

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Offline Richard Symonds

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Bad news, and Robert Buckland MP is part of it
« on: June 05, 2013, 04:53:00 PM »
Today I received the following email from 38 degrees

Dear Richard,

It’s bad news. Yesterday MPs voted against including a clean energy target in the Energy Bill. [1]

The vote was painfully close - if just 12 MPs had voted differently, we would have won. [2] It was edge-of-the-seat stuff. Yesterday, it felt too close to call. But ultimately, we just didn’t have enough votes.

It’s sad when we lose. Especially when it’s on something as important as protecting our planet. But we fought valiantly and gave it our all, and today we can be proud as well as disappointed.

A year ago, the prospect of so many MPs voting for a clean energy target was inconceivable. Our work, alongside our friends at Greenpeace and Friends of the Earth, changed that.

Together we sent tens of thousands of emails and tweets, and made hundreds of phone calls to our MPs. We also ramped up the pressure on wavering MPs with adverts in local newspapers, thousands of leaflets through doors and many face-to-face meetings. It’s thanks to all we did together that so many MPs switched their votes, and turned out yesterday in support.

This is not where we wanted to be today. But there’s still hope that we’ll secure the target we need. The Energy Bill will now go to the House of Lords to be debated again. They have the power to include a clean energy target. They are much more likely to do so because it was such a close vote in the House of Commons.

Sadly, your MP, Robert Buckland, didn’t vote the right way. Whether it was because he voted with his political party, or he wanted to back dirty fossil fuels or for some other reason, he backed George Osborne at the expense of the environment and against the wishes of his voters.

It’s important that we let those who voted against the clean energy target know that we’re disappointed in them. It will show that we’re watching them, so in the future they’ll know there are consequences for their actions. And next time there’s a big climate vote, they’ll be under no doubt from the outset where their voters stand.

Could you email Robert Buckland now? Click here to him know that you’re disappointed in how he voted.
https://secure.38degrees.org.uk/mp-voted-against

So, overall, a disappointing result. Sometimes it can be tempting at moments like this to feel like giving up. But we know we did our best. And we know that if we keep working together, there will be chances in the future to turn it around. So let’s take a moment to give ourselves a pat on the back. We'll keep going, because we know it's the right thing to do. And because we know that together we can make a difference.


Thanks for everything you do,

Susannah, Becky, James and the 38 Degrees team

PS. Campaigns like this one don’t cost the earth, but they cost something. 38 Degrees relies entirely on donations from members like you, giving one-off donations or small regular sums of £2 or £3 per week.

Would you consider making a donation? Just 2 or 3 pounds a week makes a massive difference. It only takes a few minutes to set up, and it means that we can pull together massive campaigns like this over the days, weeks, months and years to come. Please click here to get started:
https://secure.38degrees.org.uk/start-a-direct-debit/?ref=ebillmpagainst

NOTES
[1] BBC: Energy Bill: Government sees off rebellion over 2030 target: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-22764955
[2] The Public Whip: Energy Bill - clause 1 - decarbonisation: http://www.publicwhip.org.uk/division.php?date=2013-06-04&number=18
 
 

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All my posts are my own opinion and do not represent any political organization or group

Offline Spunkymonkey

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Re: Bad news, and Robert Buckland MP is part of it
« Reply #1 on: June 05, 2013, 05:38:48 PM »
Quote
Sadly, your MP, Robert Buckland, didn’t vote the right way. Whether it was because he voted with his political party, or he wanted to back dirty fossil fuels or for some other reason, he backed George Osborne at the expense of the environment and against the wishes of his voters.

How do 38 Degrees know that this was against the wishes of his voters?

Offline the gorgon

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Re: Bad news, and Robert Buckland MP is part of it
« Reply #2 on: June 05, 2013, 07:02:35 PM »
Well, Swindon is considered to be the average British town and a survey last year said the 9 out of 10 people want more green energy.  So I'd imagine a similar proportion of people in South Swindon would agree.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2012/apr/23/people-want-more-renewable-energy

Offline Des Morgan

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Re: Bad news, and Robert Buckland MP is part of it
« Reply #3 on: June 05, 2013, 07:23:21 PM »
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Sadly, your MP, Robert Buckland, didn’t vote the right way

How dare he not vote the 'right way' by which I presume you mean your way!! I am delighted Robert voted the way he did.

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It’s important that we let those who voted against the clean energy target know that we’re disappointed in them. It will show that we’re watching them, so in the future they’ll know there are consequences for their actions.

Wow - threats as well. I wonder what the consequences for their actions will be - please do tell all. Are you going to stoop to the same tactics as anti vivisectionists and the supposed animal welfare 'supporters'?

Quote
because we know it's the right thing to do.

Oh that's okay then

Offline Spunkymonkey

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Re: Bad news, and Robert Buckland MP is part of it
« Reply #4 on: June 05, 2013, 07:50:57 PM »
Well, Swindon is considered to be the average British town and a survey last year said the 9 out of 10 people want more green energy.  So I'd imagine a similar proportion of people in South Swindon would agree.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2012/apr/23/people-want-more-renewable-energy


A survey sponsored by Friends of the Earth and Scottish Renewables is similar to research by Whiskas claiming that 9/10 cats prefer Whiskas.

The figures reported in the article don't stack up and if the comments section is representative, it would imply that 9/10 is a huge exaggeration.

The first line of the article states that 9/10 people prefer clean domestic energy compared to expensive imported gas. That isn't quite the same as saying 9/10 want more green energy. If a survey asks a leading question it usually results in the answer required by the sponsor.

Offline Mart

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Re: Bad news, and Robert Buckland MP is part of it
« Reply #5 on: June 05, 2013, 08:26:26 PM »
A survey sponsored by Friends of the Earth and Scottish Renewables is similar to research by Whiskas claiming that 9/10 cats prefer Whiskas.

Actually it's 8 out of 10. The other 2 prefer Lesley Judd.

http://www.maxilyrics.com/half-man-half-biscuit-99%25-of-gargoyles-look-like-bob-todd-lyrics-a1c8.html

I like Green Energy, I like cheap energy more. That's because I have to pay for the energy I use and I have a finite income, whereas, the energy companies have unlimited options for raising bills.

I do have a nice green supplier, which is as far as I can go.

My issue with the green buggers is that they is far too trendy and right on. I'd embrace it more if it was being peddled by geezers smoking disreputable roll-ups and gunge under their finger nails.
Sometimes I think you have to march right in and demand your rights, even if you don’t know what your rights are, or who the person is you’re talking to. Then, on the way out, slam the door.

Offline Spunkymonkey

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Re: Bad news, and Robert Buckland MP is part of it
« Reply #6 on: June 05, 2013, 09:11:00 PM »
What exactly is clean energy? This article suggests that solar panels aren't so green after all.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/jennifer-grayson/eco-etiquette-how-green-a_b_554717.html

Take away the subsidises that we all pay for through taxes and they aren't so cheap either. We will end up going down the nuclear route eventually.

Offline Mart

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Re: Bad news, and Robert Buckland MP is part of it
« Reply #7 on: June 05, 2013, 09:21:59 PM »
We will end up going down the nuclear route eventually.

Bit extreme, can't we just compare prices at Moneysupermarket?

Worked for me.
Sometimes I think you have to march right in and demand your rights, even if you don’t know what your rights are, or who the person is you’re talking to. Then, on the way out, slam the door.

Offline Spunkymonkey

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Re: Bad news, and Robert Buckland MP is part of it
« Reply #8 on: June 05, 2013, 09:24:34 PM »
Bit extreme, can't we just compare prices at Moneysupermarket?

Or wear a sweater.

Offline Simon

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Re: Bad news, and Robert Buckland MP is part of it
« Reply #9 on: June 05, 2013, 09:44:30 PM »
My issue with the green buggers is that they is far too trendy and right on. I'd embrace it more if it was being peddled by geezers smoking disreputable roll-ups and gunge under their finger nails.

I smoke rollups. Not sure how I'd need to roll them in order to make them suitably disreputable though  :o

Take away the subsidises that we all pay for through taxes and they aren't so cheap either. We will end up going down the nuclear route eventually.

Take away the subsidies that nuclear needs in order to be financially viable and it's not so cheap either. And the fuel is still going to run out eventually. And we (and our descendents for longer than there has been homo sapiens) still have yet to work out what to do with the waste products

Quote
It’s important that we let those who voted against the clean energy target know that we’re disappointed in them. It will show that we’re watching them, so in the future they’ll know there are consequences for their actions.

Wow - threats as well. I wonder what the consequences for their actions will be - please do tell all. Are you going to stoop to the same tactics as anti vivisectionists and the supposed animal welfare 'supporters'?

Des, you do yourself no favours by saying things like that. You seem like a very rational and intelligent person most of the time. But this is not one of those times.

I intend to carry out acts of "domestic terrorism" such as
* Telling my MP that I'm not happy with the way he voted, and that he won't get my vote in the next general unless he bucks his ideas up
* Telling anyone who'll listen that I'm not happy with the way my MP has represented me, and that they should think hard about whether to re-elect him when the time comes.
We are all in this together, but some of us are more in it than others (with apologies to George Orwell)

Offline I Could Do That

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Re: Bad news, and Robert Buckland MP is part of it
« Reply #10 on: June 06, 2013, 03:21:32 AM »
I'll be joining the same malicia group as Simon and carrying out identical acts of terrorism
Proud to be gone

Offline Geoff Reid

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Re: Bad news, and Robert Buckland MP is part of it
« Reply #11 on: June 06, 2013, 04:40:08 AM »

I didn't get involved with this particular action by 38 Degrees because I lacked sufficient knowledge of the bill to justify my asking Robert to go one way or the other.

As far as the campaign rhetoric goes I don't see it as being any better/worse than that pumped out by any of the political parties and I'd support 38 Degrees right to campaign/lobby in any legal way they see fit.

As we've already noted, each of us is free to support, or not, each of their actions as and when we see fit.  This time I chose not to, although that doesn't neccessarily mean that I wouldn't have supported if I'd had more time and better knowledge of the subject.


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Offline Muggins

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Re: Bad news, and Robert Buckland MP is part of it
« Reply #12 on: June 06, 2013, 08:52:42 AM »
I joined in, not because I know the techno bits, but because it's logical, that Nuclear is NOT the way to go, seeing as how we don't know what to do with what's left over and have anywhere really safe to store it until we do. 

Many are agreeing with the solar way and I know this simply because a lot more are being installed on roofs - can't hide your thinking once you've done that.  I predict that it won't be long before people will expect to have a panel or ten on their newly built homes. 

I predict that it won't be too long before Councils find the funds to install them on their housing stock. Not long after they get their thinking caps on.

I predict wind turbines will become less intrusive on the landscape and also more efficient for home or estate instalment.

This must be viable or businesses would not be springing up all over the place. 

Why would anyone be scared of this progress? 

And now the news that they are going to store nuclear waster at Hinkley point - that's updown wind from here, direct. Anything that goes off there, comes this way!
Oi! Listen mush. Old eyes, remember? I’ve been around the block a few times. More than a few. They’ve knocked down the blocks I’ve been around and rebuilt them as bigger blocks. Super blocks. And I’ve been round them as well.  The Doctor (Night Terrors)

Offline Alex

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Re: Bad news, and Robert Buckland MP is part of it
« Reply #13 on: June 06, 2013, 01:24:47 PM »
I had this response form Robert as I had also asked him to vote for the amendment. I am disappointed that he didn't .

Dear .........
               
Many thanks for your email about the Energy Bill and Tim Yeo MP’s amendment for a 2030 decarbonisation target.
 
As you may be aware, I have paid a close interest in this Bill. I sat on the Public Bill Committee for the Energy Bill, I have met organisations like Friends of the Earth to hear their concerns and I joined a delegation of Conservative MPs to meet the Prime Minister earlier this year to press the case for a low-carbon economy and the huge investment potential it bodes. It is vital that we continue to reduce our carbon emissions in the UK, in line with our international commitments, and I support the spread of renewable technology. I am also proud that Swindon plays host to a number of renewable energy companies and welcome projects like the solar farm in Wroughton.
 
However, I voted against Tim Yeo MP’s amendment on Tuesday 4th June. I wholeheartedly support the aspiration behind his amendment, for a decarbonisation target range to be set. Nevertheless, the details behind Mr Yeo’s amendment were sadly lacking.
 
There were no details as to how we could get from 2013 to 2030 and achieve such a target with current technologies. For instance, the future of new nuclear in the UK is highly uncertain and I am not confident that we can rely on it for our future energy needs. In other areas, highly promising renewable technologies like offshore wind unfortunately remain too expensive for widespread deployment. New solutions like Carbon Capture and Storage are interesting and may radically reduce the carbon emissions of fossil fuels like coal and gas but they are not yet commercially viable. In summary, it is not clear how we would go about meeting this decarbonisation target range with the current energy mix and technologies. No responsible Government would commit industries and consumers to this target without knowing how to achieve it.
 
Nonetheless, I still wholeheartedly support the principles behind a decarbonisation target range. I want the UK to transition to a low-carbon economy, both because of the environmental imperatives of climate change and because of the potential boons of a new industrial renaissance. That is why I was pleased that the Government has still committed to setting a decarbonisation target and has laid its own amendment to the Energy Bill to enable a legally binding decarbonisation target for the electricity sector to be set in 2016. It has been decided to set the target in 2016, once the Climate Change Committee has provided advice in line with the fifth Carbon Budget which covers the corresponding period. This will provide the Climate Change Committee with the time to methodically analyse how exactly we can go about decarbonising our economy to meet the target.
 
It was my intention to speak in the debate on Tuesday 4th June to seek the Minister’s reassurance that the Government remains fully committed to setting the decarbonisation target in 2016, but I am afraid that the debate was well attended and I did not get the chance to do so. Notwithstanding this, I have already discussed the matter with Ministers at length and have been reassured before that a target range will be set in place. I will continue to keep a watchful eye on this Bill as it goes to the House of Lords.
 
While I do appreciate that my vote on this amendment may have come as a disappointment to you, I hope that I have explained why I did so and reassured you that I remain committed to a low-carbon future.
 
Thank you again for taking the time to contact me.
 
Yours sincerely,
Robert Buckland MP
 
 

Offline Geoff Reid

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Re: Bad news, and Robert Buckland MP is part of it
« Reply #14 on: June 06, 2013, 03:05:52 PM »

Thanks Alex :)

Did any North Swindon members/readers contact & receive a response from Justin Tomlinson?

Offline the gorgon

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Re: Bad news, and Robert Buckland MP is part of it
« Reply #15 on: June 06, 2013, 06:21:01 PM »
Having read the response I must say his decision, on the face of it, seems logical in the current economic climate.   

Offline Mart

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Re: Bad news, and Robert Buckland MP is part of it
« Reply #16 on: June 06, 2013, 06:53:31 PM »
I treated his response the same way as my correspondence is treated, it's in my in-tray and I'll get someone to send out a standard acknowledgment, ooh, any day now.

Energy is good stuff but no matter what it's costing anyone, anywhere and anytime I can only afford what I can afford.

Hardly inspiring as a planet saving mantra, but dems de facts.
Sometimes I think you have to march right in and demand your rights, even if you don’t know what your rights are, or who the person is you’re talking to. Then, on the way out, slam the door.

Offline Simon

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Re: Bad news, and Robert Buckland MP is part of it
« Reply #17 on: June 06, 2013, 07:51:32 PM »
Quote from: Robert Buckland, MP for South Swindon (Con)
However, I voted against Tim Yeo MP’s amendment on Tuesday 4th June. I wholeheartedly support the aspiration behind his amendment, for a decarbonisation target range to be set. Nevertheless, the details behind Mr Yeo’s amendment were sadly lacking.
 
There were no details as to how we could get from 2013 to 2030 and achieve such a target with current technologies.


 :bash: Zero Carbon Britain 2030 report. I sent him a link to it ages ago, and he responded so I guess he must have read at least some of it. Or has he since forgotten reading it?
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Offline Des Morgan

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Re: Bad news, and Robert Buckland MP is part of it
« Reply #18 on: June 07, 2013, 08:47:28 AM »
Quote
because it's logical, that Nuclear is NOT the way to go, seeing as how we don't know what to do with what's left over and have anywhere really safe to store it until we do


Actually it is logical to 'go nuclear' if we want future energy to be widely and readily available.

Quote
I predict that it won't be too long before Councils find the funds to install them on their housing stock. Not long after they get their thinking caps on.


Muggins - they have already started on other Council owned buildings and allegeldy are in receipt of substantial sums by way of the Feed In Tariff.

Quote
I predict wind turbines will become less intrusive on the landscape and also more efficient for home or estate instalment.

Let's wait and see if 'Mystic muggins' predictions come true lol :coolsmiley:



« Last Edit: June 07, 2013, 09:29:44 AM by Des Morgan »

Offline Muggins

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Re: Bad news, and Robert Buckland MP is part of it
« Reply #19 on: June 07, 2013, 08:56:01 AM »
Des "Let's wait and see if 'Mystic muggins' predictions come true lol :coolsmiley:"

Ye may mock, mystic I am not, but told that I have more than my fair share of perception and intuition.
I'm surprised you did not have anything to say about these two points.

"Why would anyone be scared of this progress? 

And now the news that they are going to store nuclear waster at Hinkley point - that's updown wind from here, direct. Anything that goes off there, comes this way!"
Oi! Listen mush. Old eyes, remember? I’ve been around the block a few times. More than a few. They’ve knocked down the blocks I’ve been around and rebuilt them as bigger blocks. Super blocks. And I’ve been round them as well.  The Doctor (Night Terrors)