Author Topic: Budget 2013/2014 - Or: 'Where's Roddy's Chopper Falling Next?'  (Read 15111 times)

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Offline Jodie Maggio

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Re: Budget 2013/2014 - Or: 'Where's Roddy's Chopper Falling Next?'
« Reply #40 on: January 21, 2013, 10:56:50 AM »
Where will the cash be culled from? As Rod leads Swindon along the road towards Torygeddon what is left in the  Torylite, skinny, lowfat council cup?

Perhaps thats what annoyed Bluh at the council meeting when the opposition as well as several people from the public gallery reminded him of the profligate style of his adminsitration and he chose to have a go at Mrs Boyd.

Martin
I know you have made it your business to understand about borrowing and investing public money and the exact position of the Rents Account and the General Fund
Jim Grant quoted directly from the Cabinet report of 12 December 2012 page 50 6.2.1 to say that Swindon Council had borrowed £92 million pounds and that was costing the people of Swindon £8 Million a year and that when Labour left office the Council was in surplus.
A bit of rounding going here but it is the truth. If you tried to explain it properly to the Adver the story would get spiked.
There is a presumption in some Tories that the rest of us are idiots and that it couldn’t be true so they went looking for evidence that Labour was in fact a capital borrower in 2002 and 3 and found the reports appearing to show exactly that. The very same reports showed that the Council had investments at that time amounting to more than the borrowings of 7 million and 6.6 million but poor Dale did bother to read the whole report, he had what he wanted, he wrote his resolution.
The resolution was an excuse for me to give them a lecture on treasury finance and point out that they are right now gross borrowers to the tune of £258 Million and that Jim didn’t use that figure as that would be unfair as it included the HRA borrowings. I dropped in to the speech that we had been right about the HRA and that the Council had been in capital borrowing surplus right up until Bluh got rid of Nick Martin as the lead member for finance. I finished with questioning Hennan and Reynard’s loyalty to Bluh given they had provided us with the opportunity to say all this.
Next it was Kevin Small taking the mickey of their leaflets from yesteryear and questioning the politicisation of Officers.  Jim grant topped it off with repeating all the accusations that got them going in the first place.
Bluh was beside himself with fury but couldn’t show it, tried to respond and we were all barracking him and he settled on Kareem Boyd to have a go at.

Offline Geoff Reid

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Re: Budget 2013/2014 - Or: 'Where's Roddy's Chopper Falling Next?'
« Reply #41 on: January 21, 2013, 02:20:54 PM »
No. The £4 Million gap must be closed before the budget is set this year and agreed at the budget setting meeting.

........This is the year two budget so he'll be seeking to cut another £15 Million next year.

I think you're right but of more interest to me is where you made that post from  ???

Have you been parking outside Chez Vile and using my wifi again?  ;D

Offline Geoff Reid

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Re: Budget 2013/2014 - Or: 'Where's Roddy's Chopper Falling Next?'
« Reply #42 on: January 21, 2013, 02:23:40 PM »


...as to 'where will the money be culled from?' it's been suggested that 'localities' might be led towards Madame Le Guillotine next, but who knows.

Offline Des Morgan

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Re: Budget 2013/2014 - Or: 'Where's Roddy's Chopper Falling Next?'
« Reply #43 on: January 21, 2013, 02:36:44 PM »
What about 'culling' the Health Ambassadors

Offline Richard Symonds

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Re: Budget 2013/2014 - Or: 'Where's Roddy's Chopper Falling Next?'
« Reply #44 on: January 21, 2013, 03:25:15 PM »
I believe the localities staff are one of the few SBC employees left and you have to ask how much they cost?

I met the West Swindon lot at Asda some months ago and had quite a chat with them.  I asked them to investigate a number of issues, but sadly have yet to hear from them.  So maybe they represent an unnecessary cost in these difficult times.

Who has the political courage to raise the cost of the localities team at the budget debate?

You can look at cutting money to localities but shouldn't the first port of call be the Cost of Consultants and money made available to Forward (Backward) Swindon?

Rod's Cabinet have a big step to make, the hardest bit will be finding the first two million!
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Offline oldtowner

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Re: Budget 2013/2014 - Or: 'Where's Roddy's Chopper Falling Next?'
« Reply #45 on: January 21, 2013, 04:01:12 PM »
Given that Wiltshire CC functions with around 90 councillors and no Chief Executive why does a place the size of Swindon need 57 councillors and a Chief Executive and so many senior officers?

Just posing the question.

For the record I have nothing against the Chief Executive. I am just looking at roles and their cost to the taxpayer and are they affordable in the current climate.

Someone also has to look at some of these long term contract that the Council has entered into. I remain to be convinced they are cost effective. Surely by limiting the supply pool then you reduce your bargaining power - basic economics of supply and demand

Richard ref Forward Swindon I am of the opinion that they dont get enough to do what is truly required of them.

Therefore if they are not going to be properly funded then they should have all funding withdrawn because they will never be in a position to deliver. The humane thing is to run them through with a bayonet rather than have death by a thousand cuts (no pun intended but hey it works)

Offline Mickraker

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Re: Budget 2013/2014 - Or: 'Where's Roddy's Chopper Falling Next?'
« Reply #46 on: January 21, 2013, 06:16:47 PM »
Therefore if they are not going to be properly funded then they should have all funding withdrawn because they will never be in a position to deliver. The humane thing is to run them through with a bayonet rather than have death by a thousand cuts (no pun intended but hey it works)

They don't like it up em Captain Mainwaring they don't like it up em they don't  :-\
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Offline Muggins

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Re: Budget 2013/2014 - Or: 'Where's Roddy's Chopper Falling Next?'
« Reply #47 on: January 21, 2013, 06:27:21 PM »
Richard Quote "I asked them to investigate a number of issues, but sadly have yet to hear from them"

It may not be their role to do that?  Plus maternity leave, plus answering everyone elses investigations?  Did they explain what their roles was?  Did they tell you how many wards they have to cover?   

Oldtowner, could it be that despite the apparent not much difference in number of WWC and Swindon councillors, that the truth could lie in the population they represent. More to the square inch in Swindon than the whole of Wiltshire?
Oi! Listen mush. Old eyes, remember? I’ve been around the block a few times. More than a few. They’ve knocked down the blocks I’ve been around and rebuilt them as bigger blocks. Super blocks. And I’ve been round them as well.  The Doctor (Night Terrors)

Offline Mart

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Re: Budget 2013/2014 - Or: 'Where's Roddy's Chopper Falling Next?'
« Reply #48 on: January 21, 2013, 07:48:04 PM »
Oldtowner, could it be that despite the apparent not much difference in number of WWC and Swindon councillors, that the truth could lie in the population they represent. More to the square inch in Swindon than the whole of Wiltshire?

Ah, more sources of advice though. Somewhat academic as the majority of councillors have a bit of a tendency to listen to whatever Mr Whippy says and so follows co-ordinated head nodding on one side of the chamber complimented by head shaking on the other side. Not quite sure where the electorate fits into it all really.

and

If you, as in the local authority, just concentrated on the core activities you could get more done with less nodding heads in the chamber.

I mean, how many ways are there to empty a feckin bin, if you know what I mean?

S'pect they 'll find 50m to collect buckets of sunshine though ........
Sometimes I think you have to march right in and demand your rights, even if you don’t know what your rights are, or who the person is you’re talking to. Then, on the way out, slam the door.

Offline oldtowner

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Re: Budget 2013/2014 - Or: 'Where's Roddy's Chopper Falling Next?'
« Reply #49 on: January 21, 2013, 07:53:48 PM »
Muggins I agree that population plays a part ;

Swindon has a resident population of 209200 and 57 councillors = 3670 per councillor

Wiltshire Unitary authority provides local government services for 435000 residents and has 98 councillors = 4440 per councillor

So if swindon councillors represented 4440 residents then we would only need 47 councillors for our current population

Offline Richard Symonds

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Re: Budget 2013/2014 - Or: 'Where's Roddy's Chopper Falling Next?'
« Reply #50 on: January 21, 2013, 09:16:48 PM »
Richard Quote "I asked them to investigate a number of issues, but sadly have yet to hear from them"

It may not be their role to do that?

Well then what is the point of them?

Plus maternity leave, I think that may be covered by law!!  plus answering everyone elses investigations? When you are asking questions in relation to your community are you bothered about anyone else if you don't get answers?

Did they explain what their roles was?  Did they tell you how many wards they have to cover? Do they have to do this and what is their function if they are exhibiting in a shopping centre? 

That aside can we afford the luxury of these people in very challenging times when adult care is under threat and £70,000 is being removed from Dial a Ride?  They are nice to have but an unnecessary cost in times of difficulty.  What to do you want M, localities or proper care for the elderly, you can't have both!!

With this type of wishy washy type of approach it is no small wonder that nothing is achieved.
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Offline Geoff Reid

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Re: Budget 2013/2014 - Or: 'Where's Roddy's Chopper Falling Next?'
« Reply #51 on: January 21, 2013, 10:12:16 PM »

So if swindon councillors represented 4440 residents then we would only need 47 councillors for our current population

That's a vision I can get vibrant about.  Aren't we constantly told that competition is a good thing?, and with only 47 seats the competition for them ought to be so fierce that the deadwood, lazy, incompetent and disinterested (of all parties) shouldn't really stand a chance.....

Offline Des Morgan

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Re: Budget 2013/2014 - Or: 'Where's Roddy's Chopper Falling Next?'
« Reply #52 on: January 21, 2013, 10:27:10 PM »
Quote
Given that Wiltshire CC functions with around 90 councillors and no Chief Executive why does a place the size of Swindon need 57 councillors and a Chief Executive and so many senior officers?

It is also a fact that within the Borough there are also parish councillors and town councillors - how many layers of 'representation' do you need.

I admire the parish councillors but when they get over ruled at every opportunity one wonders why they do the job. I note Blunsdon councillors couldn't even persuade SBC councillors to support them over 3 lousy signs.

As for the guys in Wanborough, they graft so hard on behalf of the Parish and yet seem so impotent against the might of Coun Bluh and his colleagues.

Offline Muggins

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Re: Budget 2013/2014 - Or: 'Where's Roddy's Chopper Falling Next?'
« Reply #53 on: January 22, 2013, 09:41:09 AM »
Richard Quote: When you are asking questions in relation to your community are you bothered about anyone else if you don't get answers?

It's not often I don't get answers! And before I beleive an answer I usually get replies from at least three places anyway.  I don't ask questions for the sake of it or when I know others are asking the same question, and usually not more than one at a time. If others are also complaining rather than asking, that's a different matter.

I was only interested to find out if you had found out what is the role of the locality teams?
If they had display boards, did they not tell you?  And I think I've said before on TS that I KNOW their roles were largely experimental for this period.

I agree with you that some jobs are more importnat than others and some are just too important to lose. 


So if swindon councillors represented 4440 residents then we would only need 47 councillors for our current population

That's a vision I can get vibrant about.  Aren't we constantly told that competition is a good thing?, and with only 47 seats the competition for them ought to be so fierce that the deadwood, lazy, incompetent and disinterested (of all parties) shouldn't really stand a chance.....


Geoff: I can see the sense in less councillors in a well run town with tuned in active residents.

Unfortunately I can predict what will happen here, the lazy and incompetent would still be with us.  Mainly because things aren't based on ability and energy, but who your mates are.
Competition is not fierce because no one wants to be a councillor except them that ought not to be one in the first place or amongst those to whom it has become an habit/hobby.
Oi! Listen mush. Old eyes, remember? I’ve been around the block a few times. More than a few. They’ve knocked down the blocks I’ve been around and rebuilt them as bigger blocks. Super blocks. And I’ve been round them as well.  The Doctor (Night Terrors)

Offline Outoftowner

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Re: Budget 2013/2014 - Or: 'Where's Roddy's Chopper Falling Next?'
« Reply #54 on: January 22, 2013, 10:29:35 AM »
Muggins said:
Quote
except them that ought not to be one in the first place or amongst those to whom it has become an habit/hobby.

Quite correct Muggins. I also believe that there are a few SBC Councillors whose businesses are not doing as well as they would like you to think, so they need the MONEY that Swindon taxpayers so willingly provide.
What's it all about?

Offline Richard Symonds

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Re: Budget 2013/2014 - Or: 'Where's Roddy's Chopper Falling Next?'
« Reply #55 on: January 22, 2013, 10:56:58 AM »
What about 'culling' the Health Ambassadors

Des I am told they are funded via the NHS, because I have already had this conversation with one of their number!
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Offline Mart

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Re: Budget 2013/2014 - Or: 'Where's Roddy's Chopper Falling Next?'
« Reply #56 on: January 22, 2013, 08:44:31 PM »
with only 47 seats the competition for them ought to be so fierce that the deadwood, lazy, incompetent and disinterested (of all parties) shouldn't really stand a chance.....

According to my calculations you need a maximum of 3 councillors.

1 to say what will be done, 1 to disagree and 1 to abstain. We could maybe stretch to say 13 hangers on. Their role will be to nod sagely in agreement or shake their heads so vehemently in disagreement that they emit a sloppy slapping sound as they do so. It's important that some abstain in the interest of balance.

Vote Deadwood.

Most do.
Sometimes I think you have to march right in and demand your rights, even if you don’t know what your rights are, or who the person is you’re talking to. Then, on the way out, slam the door.

Offline Muggins

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Re: Budget 2013/2014 - Or: 'Where's Roddy's Chopper Falling Next?'
« Reply #57 on: January 23, 2013, 08:30:33 AM »
with only 47 seats the competition for them ought to be so fierce that the deadwood, lazy, incompetent and disinterested (of all parties) shouldn't really stand a chance.....

According to my calculations you need a maximum of 3 councillors.

1 to say what will be done, 1 to disagree and 1 to abstain. We could maybe stretch to say 13 hangers on. Their role will be to nod sagely in agreement or shake their heads so vehemently in disagreement that they emit a sloppy slapping sound as they do so. It's important that some abstain in the interest of balance.

Vote Deadwood.

Most do.

Isn't that what we've got now?  >:(
Oi! Listen mush. Old eyes, remember? I’ve been around the block a few times. More than a few. They’ve knocked down the blocks I’ve been around and rebuilt them as bigger blocks. Super blocks. And I’ve been round them as well.  The Doctor (Night Terrors)

Offline Richard Symonds

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Re: Budget 2013/2014 - Or: 'Where's Roddy's Chopper Falling Next?'
« Reply #58 on: January 23, 2013, 10:43:58 AM »
with only 47 seats the competition for them ought to be so fierce that the deadwood, lazy, incompetent and disinterested (of all parties) shouldn't really stand a chance.....

According to my calculations you need a maximum of 3 councillors.

1 to say what will be done, 1 to disagree and 1 to abstain. We could maybe stretch to say 13 hangers on. Their role will be to nod sagely in agreement or shake their heads so vehemently in disagreement that they emit a sloppy slapping sound as they do so. It's important that some abstain in the interest of balance.

Vote Deadwood.

Most do.

Now if you were to stand Mart Council would become far more interesting would it not? 

Vote Mart

Vote Common Sense
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Offline Richard Symonds

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Re: Budget 2013/2014 - Or: 'Where's Roddy's Chopper Falling Next?'
« Reply #59 on: January 23, 2013, 10:46:32 AM »
So where will Roddy's chopper fall?

My money is on Localities, but not Forward (Bsckward) Swindon even if they could save a considerable amount of money by moving 'in house'.
All my posts are my own opinion and do not represent any political organization or group