Author Topic: Eastcott Ward - Swindon Lib Democrat Pajak Plays Pinnochio Politics  (Read 30315 times)

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Offline Mart

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Re: Eastcott Ward - Swindon Lib Democrat Pajak Plays Pinnochio Politics
« Reply #20 on: April 14, 2011, 10:11:27 AM »
I think that there is an alternative route.

I would campaign for a crossing in Clifton Street and a postbox in Kingshill thus catching political adversaries off guard. I'd fit a slide to the Dixon Street steps which I prefer to think of as the Stafford Street steps. Or a canal.

Another example of politics actually being bad for people.
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Offline I Could Do That

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Re: Eastcott Ward - Swindon Lib Democrat Pajak Plays Pinnochio Politics
« Reply #21 on: April 14, 2011, 12:50:54 PM »
A canal on Stafford steps?
That would be a cascade.
Perhaps we could incorporate Swindon's answer to Caen Hill Locks.
They could be made of cardboard and corrugated iron.
I've got a piece of left over pond liner to start the project/vision/sustainable feature
Proud to be gone

Offline Geoff Reid

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Re: Eastcott Ward - Swindon Lib Democrat Pajak Plays Pinnochio Politics
« Reply #22 on: April 14, 2011, 04:53:10 PM »
A canal on Stafford steps?
That would be a cascade.
Perhaps we could incorporate Swindon's answer to Caen Hill Locks.
They could be made of cardboard and corrugated iron.
I've got a piece of left over pond liner to start the project/vision/sustainable feature

A Pissoir-Plus :)

Offline Spectre

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Re: Eastcott Ward - Swindon Lib Democrat Pajak Plays Pinnochio Politics
« Reply #23 on: April 14, 2011, 05:22:00 PM »
A canal on Stafford steps?
That would be a cascade.
Perhaps we could incorporate Swindon's answer to Caen Hill Locks.
They could be made of cardboard and corrugated iron.
I've got a piece of left over pond liner to start the project/vision/sustainable feature

A Pissoir-Plus :)


When I lived on Dixon St some 40+ years ago, that was the normal use for the steps Geoff.

Offline Geoff Reid

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Re: Eastcott Ward - Swindon Lib Democrat Pajak Plays Pinnochio Politics
« Reply #24 on: April 14, 2011, 06:14:26 PM »
 
Oh dear. It seems that the Eastcott Lib Dems are at it again, spinning yarns and claiming credit for things they have no right to.  At this rate Stan & Dave will need a flock of Woodpeckers to peck their noses back down to size.

May take me a few days to corroborate and verify what I'm hearing but I don't doubt my sources.

In the meantime, if you live in Eastcott and want to let Swindon know anything in confidence, remember that you can use leaks@talkswindon.org to drop Swindon Lamplighters a line.

Offline Drone

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Re: Eastcott Ward - Swindon Lib Democrat Pajak Plays Pinnochio Politics
« Reply #25 on: April 15, 2011, 06:53:15 AM »
 :popcorn:
derp derp herp herp derp

Offline Geoff Reid

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Re: Eastcott Ward - Swindon Lib Democrat Pajak Plays Pinnochio Politics
« Reply #26 on: April 20, 2011, 02:34:19 PM »
 
Yep, the Lib Dems have now put out their latest leaflet in Eastcott:



It looks to me like a desperate hodge-podge of half-truths & outright lies.

I don't want to make this too easy for observers   :wink: so I'll invite comments as to what, and where, the bullshits are on this leaflet before adding my 2p's worth.




Offline 20Eyes

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Re: Eastcott Ward - Swindon Lib Democrat Pajak Plays Pinnochio Politics
« Reply #27 on: April 20, 2011, 04:28:37 PM »
Yep, the Lib Dems have now put out their latest leaflet in Eastcott:

One thing's for sure, there's a gem of a typo on the first/front page  ;D

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Offline Drone

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Re: Eastcott Ward - Swindon Lib Democrat Pajak Plays Pinnochio Politics
« Reply #28 on: April 20, 2011, 05:06:00 PM »


This is a local election for local people! 10 mentions of the word 'local' by my count.

I do like Stan Pajak's comment: "I ask you to trust Icky Sewell" - no one available to spell check the leaflet before it went to print?
derp derp herp herp derp

Offline Ringer

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Re: Eastcott Ward - Swindon Lib Democrat Pajak Plays Pinnochio Politics
« Reply #29 on: April 20, 2011, 05:26:24 PM »
I don't want to make this too easy for observers   :wink: so I'll invite comments as to what, and where, the bullshits are on this leaflet before adding my 2p's worth.



The gate? That cannot be any party held responsible it was a planning committee decision.
Quote
However the committee were advised by officers not to impose the gate on the application as it would result in a rejection of the proposed plans and the developers could pull out of the process.

Committee member Coun Martin Wiltshire (Lib Dem, Eastcott), said: “This is a very welcome development and comes after years of work. Although this it isn’t an ideal proposal it will greatly improve this area.”

 


Maybe the adver article is missing something?  It clearly states officers advice not to impose the gate and Cllr Dave Wood Martin wiltshire are quoted.
http://www.swindonadvertiser.co.uk/news/8447600.Former_college_site_development_approved/

It says Majority Vote on a not partisan committee. 13 to 1 and I am betting  that the 1 was not a Liberal councillor?   >:D
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Offline A Mole

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Re: Eastcott Ward - Swindon Lib Democrat Pajak Plays Pinnochio Politics
« Reply #30 on: April 20, 2011, 05:58:41 PM »
Well the bit about dog fouling sounds like bullsh*t to me (no pun intended).  I have made several complaints to the Council about dog-fouling over the years and most recently had a discussion with the Head of the relevant department.  He told me - unequivocally - that the Council do not enforce dog fouling due to problems with the law and that they do not have the relevant powers to do so.  He said that this was most unlikely to change unless the law was reformed and that could take years.

Offline Tobes

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Re: Eastcott Ward - Swindon Lib Democrat Pajak Plays Pinnochio Politics
« Reply #31 on: April 20, 2011, 07:09:11 PM »
What I'm finding interesting about the campaign is that it features Stan in just about every photo, as though his endorsement might be an asset to the campaign - whereas perhaps the opposite is more likely these days.  ???

What exactly has Stan done for the residents in recent times? Its been noted and commented by many people in my part of the ward that he appears to have little or no engagement with residents. Photo opportunities for Focus aside, when was the last time anyone witnessed him out on the street canvassing support or opinion? Outside of ward issues, what has happened to the incisive voice of opposition to things like the proposed Coate development or WiFi? When he does make a rare local appearance, unfortunately he gives many people the impression of somewhat aloof disinterest. The cynics down the Beehive have nicknamed him 'Stan Pay-cheque'. Perhaps Stan is not an ideal poster boy anymore ('complacent' is a word I've heard several times). Regarding local action, it was Dave did the campaigning about the gate*. Dave and Nicky did the donkey work regarding the residents parking survey**. Consequently, Stan appearing in photos relating to those subjects might look mildly ridiculous to some.

Again, the campaigns rather clumsy avoidance of the locally obvious fact that Nicky is Dave's cohabiting other half isn't helpful either. I'm sure their position is that it shouldn't matter one way or the other what their relationship is - but that's actually precisely the point as to WHY it should have been acknowledged right from the off. To do be mealy mouthed and surreptitious about the issue will make them look naive in the eyes of many and as though they have something to hide. Its an obvious gift to the opposition.


* - Note, whilst I have decided not to stand as an independent (after being passed over for consideration by the Libs in favour of Nicky), I'll just record for prosperity here that the compromise idea of the gate at the college site was my idea. I'd also like it noted, that whilst the Lib Dems have made quite a lot of mileage regarding the proposal of the gate, it was I, as local resident who first spotted the issue of the new cut-through (after they had missed it - Martin was even on the planning committee at the time!). It was also I who started campaigning about it a full year before they did.
** Working back a few years, it was also I who started publicly campaigning regarding the proposed changes to residents parking. The topics and the coverage are all logged here on TS and on the original TS.TV report.
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Offline Richard Symonds

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Re: Eastcott Ward - Swindon Lib Democrat Pajak Plays Pinnochio Politics
« Reply #32 on: April 20, 2011, 09:37:52 PM »
Well well what an interesting leaflet!  Aren't the Liberals wonderful and extremely cuddly?

I know a few old dears who live on Kingshill who have been patiently talking to 'that very nice Councillor Pajak' about the Kingshill crossing and absolutely nothing has been done or more importantly is now not even expected to be done it has been going on so long.

So along comes Chris Watts who takes an interest in this issue and miraculously as if by magic it becomes a Liberal election promise 'action to change the way the council makes decisions on crossings.  Well you have had years to do this Stan so why should Greenhalgh take any notice of you now just because you promise it in a leaflet?

Finally if they can't even be bothered to proof read their leaflets and make two glaring mistakes should they be trusted to continue to handle the complex issues that are to be found in this ward? 

It is time for a change, pity you did not stand Tobes.
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Offline Geoff Reid

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Re: Eastcott Ward - Swindon Lib Democrat Pajak Plays Pinnochio Politics
« Reply #33 on: April 20, 2011, 11:22:10 PM »
Again, the campaigns rather clumsy avoidance of the locally obvious fact that Nicky is Dave's cohabiting other half isn't helpful either. I'm sure their position is that it shouldn't matter one way or the other what their relationship is - but that's actually precisely the point as to WHY it should have been acknowledged right from the off. To do be mealy mouthed and surreptitious about the issue will make them look naive in the eyes of many and as though they have something to hide. Its an obvious gift to the opposition.

I think it should be noted that Chris Watts hasn't sought to exploit the above.


* - Note, whilst I have decided not to stand as an independent (after being passed over for consideration by the Libs in favour of Nicky), I'll just record for prosperity here that the compromise idea of the gate at the college site was my idea. I'd also like it noted, that whilst the Lib Dems have made quite a lot of mileage regarding the proposal of the gate, it was I, as local resident who first spotted the issue of the new cut-through (after they had missed it - Martin was even on the planning committee at the time!). It was also I who started campaigning about it a full year before they did.

** Working back a few years, it was also I who started publicly campaigning regarding the proposed changes to residents parking. The topics and the coverage are all logged here on TS and on the original TS.TV report.


Yep. Tobes is absolutely correct on this.  The Eastcott 'Focus 'team' mislead residents when they claim credit for the above.  Similarly, Icky, Dave and Stan are claiming credit for removing expiry dates on residents parking visitors permits, but wasn't this actually achieved by the CP2 Central cluster group?


Well well what an interesting leaflet!  Aren't the Liberals wonderful and extremely cuddly?

Residents are beginning to see them for what they are: Politically dishonest magpies lazily feathering their nests with achievements and aspirations appropriated from others.




Finally if they can't even be bothered to proof read their leaflets and make two glaring mistakes should they be trusted to continue to handle the complex issues that are to be found in this ward? 


I reckon 'Icky Sewell' will stick.  That'll learn 'em.



It is time for a change, pity you did not stand Tobes.

2012 is the better year for Tobes to stand as an independent candidate and, should he do so, I think he would do very well.

Offline Des Morgan

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Re: Eastcott Ward - Swindon Lib Democrat Pajak Plays Pinnochio Politics
« Reply #34 on: April 21, 2011, 08:36:38 AM »
Quote
He told me - unequivocally - that the Council do not enforce dog fouling due to problems with the law and that they do not have the relevant powers to do so.  He said that this was most unlikely to change unless the law was reformed and that could take years

The Council has powers a plenty to take action against irresponsible owners who allow theire dogs to foul public spaces and refuse to clear uip the mess their pets leave.

Indeed in 2007. Coun Wren talking about dog fouling said: "We are going to target areas where there are concerns. The officers will be on the ground, they will be fully trained and looking at all aspects of enviro-crime. They will be walking the beat and they will be visible.'' Coun Peter Greenhalgh, also talking about dog fouling said: "I think it's a really positive step for Swindon, having people out there with the power to deal with these issues. The only questions to ask are where ‘the officers on the ground’ are and where are the ‘people out there’

What has changed since 2007?

We now have a supine Council who believe 'education' is more effective than 'enforcement' - sadly they can provide no proof to support such a view as they have not 'enforced' dog fouling by a single prosecution in the past 12 months.

As SCS is the newly appointed contractor responsible for clearing the bins it will be interesting to monitor their performance

Offline Richard Symonds

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Re: Eastcott Ward - Swindon Lib Democrat Pajak Plays Pinnochio Politics
« Reply #35 on: April 21, 2011, 09:28:14 AM »
What has changed since 2007?

Well we got Wi-fi and an award for it and its inception Des, what more could you possibly want?
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Offline Des Moffatt

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Re: Eastcott Ward - Swindon Lib Democrat Pajak Plays Pinnochio Politics
« Reply #36 on: April 21, 2011, 10:10:35 AM »
Three years ago I produced a leaflet where I spelt Jim Grant’s name as Gant, our proof reader being unavailable to me she being on Mayoral duty.
When the media trained Tory opposition candidate got the entire leaflet reproduced in the Adver I was extremely distressed to start with. As the evening wore on and the canvassing returns were unaffected I realised that the Adver had done us a favour, they had reproduced the whole page of our leaflet on page three the text being clearly visible. By the end of the canvassing session I was chuckling quietly to myself. Kevin though it was funny too but we never did convince Jim. I still have that Adver page stuck on my office wall to reminding not to make that mistake again. Thanks Sue for keeping us right.
The element of their leaflet on dividing houses for multi occupation is completely wrong. When this relaxation of the planning rules was announced by the ConDem Government at my instigation some research was undertaken on the Labour Groups behalf. Meanwhile the association of Local Councils mounted a legal challenge to the change in defence of communities like Rodbourne and the Town centre. That decision has gone against us. There is another way we can seek to defend our communities but that depends on the Secretary of state accepting a designated area as being of special planning consideration. We intend to pursue that directly after the election. I have spoken to officers on this, no Liberal Democrat Councillor had spoken to them when I last spoke to the relevant officers.
Dog Fowling. To give that to the Traffic Wardens is quite wrong in law and in practice. Jim Grant and I put a resolution to full Council a couple of years ago to give the power of spot fines to the Police/Police Support Officers but the Tories voted it down without real consideration it seemed, going on at length about by-laws without coherence. Many Council’s have done just that, given the police powers to spot fine the owners who permit their dogs to fowl the pavement and not removing the excrement. Hopefully we can get some research done on how successful that approach has been and revisit the issue this summer.
This Liberal leaflet is not worth the paper it written on and Chris would be well advised to dismiss it as irrelevant to his electoral success. Devout Liberals will applaud it but others will see it for what it is, without substance. Its not as bad as one the Tories produced in Pinehurst though, it has to be seen to be believed. Everything the Ballamns fought for is claimed by the Tories including the Tories having funded the Academy.
Leaflet designers can be relied to continue to mistake good graphic design a substitute for truthful information.

Offline Tobes

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Re: Eastcott Ward - Swindon Lib Democrat Pajak Plays Pinnochio Politics
« Reply #37 on: April 21, 2011, 04:51:21 PM »
Quote
2012 is the better year for Tobes to stand as an independent candidate and, should he do so, I think he would do very well.

Thank you  :) Hopefully, AV may also serve to act to encourage more independents as well.

I'm keeping my options open, as I have always felt it important to stand in the ward in which I live. The option of playing the game of wasting time running as a paper candidate underling in distant wards for x number of years doesn't really interest me. As things stand, the Lib Dems still represent the party with which I have least ideological/personal disagreement (despite the national party managing the biggest piece of electoral betrayal in recent history regarding student fees). If I were to stand under any collective banner, they would still be my party of choice, at a local level at least. However, if there's no opening for me and as I was not even judged worthy to be judged against the other candidates (if indeed there was more than one), despite my open expression of interest, then no one should be surprised if I go it alone. Mark my words,if I do in 2012, it'll be with 100% effort).

Disgruntlement aside, I have to say, in the last couple of years, Dave seems to have been very approachable - and has picked up and run with everything either me or my neighbours have suggested. He certainly deserves his salary at least on the basis of being a pretty good local ward councillor, despite his apparent reticence to slug it out in the chamber. What I'm less clear on though is the 'club' politics which takes place back behind closed doors with the rest of the Lib Dems. The suspicion remains that private quid-pro-quo deals have been done between senior party members, rather than challenging some of the worst excesses of the current council administration. If so, it doesn't serve them, the citizens of Swindon - or even, ironically, the complacent conservatives (who ought to be being effectively and publicly challenged on a daily basis to show some intellectual and ethical rigour.) My recent experiences suggest the Libs are rather closer to the established scenarios within the labour and conservative groups: an aspirant must go through a long weaning process in which one has to prove party loyalty as the paramount measure before one might be considered worthy (or safe?) to act as a representative under the party banner. Again, I think this only goes to discredit the party political process, especially when we see how much expedient floor crossing goes on anyway. Party and manifesto allegiance for a councillor ought to be very very secondary to someone's passion and ability to deliver for the ward and reflect the interests of the residents. It seem insane to me that this system mitigates between 'ordinary' active campaigners and doers within a community: they are essentially ostracised from being an active participant in local politics as anything except an ordinary bi-annual voting citizen, placard waver or a make-weight on a petition. For me, the leaflet rather emphasises that point.

Lets see what happens. In terms of it being straight fight between Nicky and Chris, I think my withdrawal will make it a much less muddied issue. I have to say, Chris's main weapon would have been to refer to the wider issues which cause disappointment with SBC, as he hasn't found a core local issue to clobber the Libs. He's simply offering a change of face - and to be honest, I think you'll find the residents in Eascott will stick with what they know unless he has something genuinely new to offer or can demonstrate that he's done something for them. He hasn't done that to date. All he's doing otherwise is hoping that disillusionment with national politics will be reflected in the local vote. Thats not exactly a brilliant mandate for a local councillor in my opinion. His electoral strength would lie with his scrutiny of WiFi, the associated criticism of the conservatives and the arguable failure of the Libs to do their jobs in opposition. He's going to have to fight something of a negative campaign if he really wants to win. Although I hear an increasing amount about what a nice guy he is, the lack of clout, reason to change and his allegiance with another discredited party will probably do for his hopes. My prediction is for a close result with a reduced Lib majority - but with Ms Sewell just shading it.
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Offline Tobes

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Re: Eastcott Ward - Swindon Lib Democrat Pajak Plays Pinnochio Politics
« Reply #38 on: April 21, 2011, 05:40:29 PM »
In the interests of balance, for all the criticism of the Libs, who's this walking with Ed Milliband?



Yes - the same Ed Milliband who consistently voted for ID cards and 90 day detention without trial. The same Ed Milliband supports the retention of DNA profiles of people who were arrested but not convicted of a crime.

Personally, I'd question voting for a man prepared to accept political assistance from a totalitarian.

Eascott voters are proud to be tolerant, libertarian and liberal with a small 'L'. Labour demonstrated that they were anything but. I think it would be fair to question the political outlook of anyone who would choose to ally with them, let alone be seen with such a high profile supporter of some of the most pernicious social policies of recent history.
 :embarassed:

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Offline Richard Symonds

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Re: Eastcott Ward - Swindon Lib Democrat Pajak Plays Pinnochio Politics
« Reply #39 on: April 21, 2011, 05:56:27 PM »
Now Tobes I believe in the Candidate Locally not the party they represent, so if you want to be successfully elected yourself you must promote what you yourself stand for and use your highly individual personality.

I am sorry I do not agree with what you have said about Chris Watts, surely you would not condemn him for anything Milliband did or did not do nationally. 

It is about local issues things like Kingshill crossings and whether or not they can be delivered.  The fact is that very nice man Stan has had years and has not delivered things should enable Chris to have a fighting chance otherwise it is very much a case of more of the same please isn't it.  Maybe Chris can prove that Eastcott has in fact been missing out by having three Liberals who from this desk appear to do an awful lot of talking and do not appear to do much.
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