Poll

In light of Dave King's editorial censoring of online comments and his continued presenting of one sided Wifi articles have you?

Author Topic: Have you recently stopped Buying the Pravdatiser  (Read 15634 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Des Moffatt

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 337
  • Hello !
Re: Have you recently stopped Buying the Pravdatiser
« Reply #20 on: March 03, 2012, 04:34:34 PM »
For some reason comments on the Advertisement for Haboakus has gone from the on line section of the local paper. Thanks to TS its here below.

No one should be taken in by the spin.
What part of NO do they not understand.
If someone is really interested in getting involved in “helping us design” this development they should first visit the residents of Surrey, Richmond, Northern and Ferndale Roads that back on to their other development in Swindon.
I and others have made it quite clear, I and others will stop them building on this open space by whatever means available.
Des Moffatt
Councillor Western


Offline Richard Symonds

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4023
Re: Have you recently stopped Buying the Pravdatiser
« Reply #21 on: March 05, 2012, 10:03:39 AM »
For some reason comments on the Advertisement for Haboakus has gone from the on line section of the local paper. Thanks to TS its here below.

No one should be taken in by the spin.
What part of NO do they not understand.
If someone is really interested in getting involved in “helping us design” this development they should first visit the residents of Surrey, Richmond, Northern and Ferndale Roads that back on to their other development in Swindon.
I and others have made it quite clear, I and others will stop them building on this open space by whatever means available.
Des Moffatt
Councillor Western

Well if that isn't a line drawn in the sand Des.

Please do not forget that Nick Martin said that he would lie down in front of the bulldozers if they had tried to move in on Shaw Forest to build a football stadium on the land that was the old municial tip.

Were Justin Tomlinson and Mike Bawden involved in that proposed development?
All my posts are my own opinion and do not represent any political organization or group

Offline Muggins

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8535
Re: Have you recently stopped Buying the Pravdatiser
« Reply #22 on: March 05, 2012, 11:03:31 AM »
That was easy for Cllr Martin to say, Shaw Tip was already designated for something else with thousands of volunteers having put something into creating it and loads of consultation done, (I was present at both more than once) way before he ever became a councillor - at least I'd never heard of him then. 

In the way the present council are - they didn't do their homework and thought nothing happened before they came on the scene and everything was up for grabs.

Of course there is also the methane time bomb that would be ticking there if development was put on top.
Oi! Listen mush. Old eyes, remember? I’ve been around the block a few times. More than a few. They’ve knocked down the blocks I’ve been around and rebuilt them as bigger blocks. Super blocks. And I’ve been round them as well.  The Doctor (Night Terrors)

Offline Morsey

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 147
  • Hello !
Re: Have you recently stopped Buying the Pravdatiser
« Reply #23 on: March 10, 2012, 09:39:52 AM »
How gratifying to read this initial thread, I thought I was the only Adver (The Most Blatant Tory Rag On The Planet) purchaser who thinks, daily, as to whether I should continue to waste two quid a week on Bluh's Bible?

I wonder why we need to have an A5 sized posed photo of a Cabinet member superimposed on almost every background 'good news, the election is forthcoming, propoganda' article it prints? Of course, our Labour Mayor had a photo alongside one piece, some two inches by one and a half and a fraction of the accompanying words!

Offline helen thompson

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 68
  • Hello !
Re: Have you recently stopped Buying the Pravdatiser
« Reply #24 on: March 10, 2012, 10:22:06 AM »
While i agree with Morsey about the Aver being a Tory rag,i would also say that it very notiable lately that coming up to the local elections Dave Wood has been in the Adver nearly every day recently .Has this got anything to do with the elections or just coincidence!

Offline Morsey

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 147
  • Hello !
Re: Have you recently stopped Buying the Pravdatiser
« Reply #25 on: March 10, 2012, 01:07:09 PM »
Yes indeed, the letters page is in fact the only place in the Adrag to promote any other party than Tory.

 Even then, not satisfied with 3 - 4 politically blue columns prominently printed alongside the letters page every week, plus promotional articles on almost every page, Tory cabinet (employees of the electorate, so say) members Bluh and Perkins and others have the audacity to post even more political claptrap via a letter!

It's so sad that they can get away with blatant electioneering in the monopolised local press, how can the individual messages get across?

Offline Tobes

  • Regents
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 4951
Re: Have you recently stopped Buying the Pravdatiser
« Reply #26 on: March 10, 2012, 01:32:26 PM »
Well, three of you with less than half a dozen posts between you come here and make the point... but could be making the self same one via a letter to the Adver. As a result, don't you think you're illustrations as to the reason why?

Complaining about something and doing something about it are different issues!

The Adver will pretty much cover the opening of a fridge door if someone bothers to tell them about it. The lack of coverage of labour councillors and the issues they're worried about is as much down to their woeful PR and communication as anything else.

The adver is hardly a 'tory rag' - thats just glib. The advers only editorial policy I can make out is a desperate attempt at survival.

If Labour supporters want more coverage - they simply have to generate some stories to cover.

T'aint brain surgery.
I do not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it - [attributed to] Voltaire... 'Entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessita' - William of Occam.... 'You have a right to feel offended, but just cos you are offended doesn't mean you are right'

Offline Muggins

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8535
Re: Have you recently stopped Buying the Pravdatiser
« Reply #27 on: March 10, 2012, 02:19:36 PM »
I have no problem with the columns alloted to the Leader of the council and the MP's, provided that when there is a change, the same courtesy is afforded to whoever it is and whatever party.   

However if the same thing and political stances are served up time after time a bit of edited needs to be done.

i.e. it's the leader of the council we should be hearing from not the leader of the Tories, and the same with the MP's.
Oi! Listen mush. Old eyes, remember? I’ve been around the block a few times. More than a few. They’ve knocked down the blocks I’ve been around and rebuilt them as bigger blocks. Super blocks. And I’ve been round them as well.  The Doctor (Night Terrors)

Offline jennyb

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1813
  • Gender: Female
  • Kareen
Re: Have you recently stopped Buying the Pravdatiser
« Reply #28 on: March 11, 2012, 10:42:03 AM »
Well, three of you with less than half a dozen posts between you come here and make the point... but could be making the self same one via a letter to the Adver. As a result, don't you think you're illustrations as to the reason why?

Complaining about something and doing something about it are different issues!

The Adver will pretty much cover the opening of a fridge door if someone bothers to tell them about it. The lack of coverage of labour councillors and the issues they're worried about is as much down to their woeful PR and communication as anything else.

The adver is hardly a 'tory rag' - thats just glib. The advers only editorial policy I can make out is a desperate attempt at survival.

If Labour supporters want more coverage - they simply have to generate some stories to cover.

T'aint brain surgery.

Tobes,

the only thing I would say is that it can take a long time to get a letter printed in the adver and have a right of reply to the Leader's weekly pontifications.  When questioned about these pontifications in Public Question time he has been heard stating ... I did not say that. A case of amnesia or delegation... who knows.. all the public can say is that if it has your name as signatory.. these are taken as your words.

The Administration has the Adver columns and letters and press releases and the Swindon News at their disposal.

By all means encourage everyone to write to the Adver or meet with the Reporters ..but for a timely communication and discussion TalkSwindon provides a unique?( please let me know if there are others) platform.
It takes wisdom to know what you know and wisdom to know what you don't know and when to call in those who do. Often the people who do know will advise that evidence and research are very helpful when making decisions. Who knows it might even save a bit of money.

Offline Morsey

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 147
  • Hello !
Re: Have you recently stopped Buying the Pravdatiser
« Reply #29 on: March 11, 2012, 06:18:41 PM »
Tobes, I am so sorry that I have only just joined in the chichat, one has to begin somewhere, is Talk Swindon exclusive, then?

I have bought the local, as used to be, newspaper for over forty years and it has deteriorated beyond belief. It IS a Tory rag, and in recent times has not presented fairness in the way it portrays all political parties in Swindon.

Do the readers really need photographs of enormous proportions to show the electorate who it is they are promoting every time, Bluh, Perkins, Tomlinson and the Welsh lawyer turn out for a pre-arranged publicity stunt. Not to mention Rex Barnet, who is the only one to ever be Swindon mayor and fall ill, though I do not wish illness on anyone, you understand.

The SAdver has taken to printing only one, or maybe two articles per page quite often, even the front cover and back page ... I can remember as many as forty or fifty items per page, when it printed news!

If the Labour group in Swindon are not getting their position across for printing, then it is something, which needs addressing pronto, though I feel that they could submit all manner of relevant material to the SAdver and this editorialship would dismiss it before going to press. They are clearly instructed on how much the Tories are pushed to the fore as if no other opinions counted.

Offline Tobes

  • Regents
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 4951
Re: Have you recently stopped Buying the Pravdatiser
« Reply #30 on: March 12, 2012, 01:20:27 AM »
Quote
Tobes, I am so sorry that I have only just joined in the chichat, one has to begin somewhere, is Talk Swindon exclusive, then?

Not, not at all - you're more than welcome as far as I'm concerned - as long as your agenda is open and clear  :) . That said, I'm just another voice here. What I say stands or falls upon its logic and persuasiveness.

Sorry if I appeared unfriendly - its just I'm personally a bit sick and tired of people with political axes to grind coming on here as 'sock-puppets', pretending to offer 'ordinary' views under a pseudonym - but very often trying to smuggle in an opinion or two as though they didn't have other very clear reasons to be partisan.

So, excuse my cynicism - but its seemed like a very odd thread for several otherwise strangers and new posters to descend upon. All the more so, in my opinion, given that the Adver, rather than being a 'tory rag' is clearly simply a struggling local newspaper, blighted by being in thrall to advertising interests and grossly understaffed.

I agree that serving councillors have lots of access to the Adver - but I repeat, its simply because they're feeding them stories. If anyone wants to do the same, they'll clearly see that the Adver will cover pretty much any story with a local angle if they can be bothered to brief them and provide a photo op. I think that one of the recent editors had a potential bias (one which he took to extra-curricular levels, if rumour is to be believed  :wink: ) - but he's long since gone.

Take it from someone who worked with the media for years - all the tories are doing is simply displaying a much better grasp of PR.

« Last Edit: March 12, 2012, 08:21:41 AM by Tobes »
I do not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it - [attributed to] Voltaire... 'Entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessita' - William of Occam.... 'You have a right to feel offended, but just cos you are offended doesn't mean you are right'

Offline Morsey

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 147
  • Hello !
Re: Have you recently stopped Buying the Pravdatiser
« Reply #31 on: March 12, 2012, 09:46:02 AM »
Tobes, thanks for taking the trouble to put me in my place. I guess you are referring, generally, to any of the new posters who have had the audacity to complain about said subject, when you use derogatory remarks? I am not under an agenda, though when a thread such as this caught my eye, I was gratified to see that I was not alone, so I signed up. I am not really under a pseudonym, but since you don't use your full name either, I will at least give a clue with my handle.

You see, I am one for total parity and fairness in all things, and that would include the local press. One can imagine those, who have abandoned the 'paper', could include those like myself and others with similar feelings as being totally sickened with so much biased coverage?

 If this publication wishes to keep the few non-Tory readers it still has then surely it is in their interest to 'think before they print'? There are more photos of Conservative Councillors in a weeks worth of SAdvers than in all the towns Tory election leaflets put together!

Regards ... Paul ... there you are, another clue!

Offline helen thompson

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 68
  • Hello !
Re: Have you recently stopped Buying the Pravdatiser
« Reply #32 on: March 12, 2012, 12:09:04 PM »
Hi Tobes
While yes i am polititcal,and my name is very clear for people to see, i am not just having a go at the adver.I feel that the B.B.B is  biased although supposdly independent.and yes i read the Guardian my thread was also about the Lib /Dems who by the way had a another picture in the adver today. The adver for me do a great job as far as sports and football in particular go it is just that when i wright to the adver very often it does not appear, so i fill a bias true or not.I will take on board my bias in future as othersmay do .

Offline Muggins

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8535
Re: Have you recently stopped Buying the Pravdatiser
« Reply #33 on: March 12, 2012, 12:12:28 PM »
"If this publication wishes to keep the few non-Tory readers it still has then surely it is in their interest to 'think before they print'? There are more photos of Conservative Councillors in a weeks worth of SAdvers than in all the towns Tory election leaflets put together!"

I still take the Adver, my excuse is that I feel the need to know what the 'opposition' is saying and how they are thinking.

Then (if I'm not in it!  ::)) I go to the crossword page!  And the public notices.

Could it be Helen, that our chat the other day reminded you to contribute more often?
Oi! Listen mush. Old eyes, remember? I’ve been around the block a few times. More than a few. They’ve knocked down the blocks I’ve been around and rebuilt them as bigger blocks. Super blocks. And I’ve been round them as well.  The Doctor (Night Terrors)

Offline Tobes

  • Regents
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 4951
Re: Have you recently stopped Buying the Pravdatiser
« Reply #34 on: March 12, 2012, 06:08:43 PM »
Quote
I guess you are referring, generally, to any of the new posters who have had the audacity to complain about said subject, when you use derogatory remarks?

In which case, I can only imagine that I've touched a nerve with what I said, for which I apologise.  ;D

However, I'd like to invite you to reconsider and re-read what I've said - nothing derogatory at all. Unless you think being questioned is an ad-hominem attack? If it suits you politically to adopt the Rod Bluhesque 'glass jaw' of offence, I guess its a useful tool, but I'd invite TS readers to interpret that strategy for what it is  ))))

Any poster on TS is at full liberty to raise any point they like - as am I - and disagree - as I am. Its called debate. If you apply some understanding and logic to a given subject, its surprising how often we can all have our eyes opened to another perspective. I'm waiting to be convinced by you.

TS, despite the apparent assumption of some, is apolitical - NOT a Labour site. Expect to have your motives questioned and your opinions cross-examined and put to the test. Its ironic that but a bare four years ago, this site was being deliberately portrayed as a TORY site by your colleagues. Ah, the sweet irony! I hope it remains what it has ALWAYS been: a site in which ordinary people ask logical questions, not somewhere dominated by party members.

Back to the thread title: If you state that you are 'non tory' as though that's some sort of inviolable badge, then you are revealing a deep-seated bias of your own. It hardly makes your judgement objective then, does it?

Quote
If this publication wishes to keep the few non-Tory readers it still has then surely it is in their interest to 'think before they print'?

What, in order to reflect YOUR bias, you mean?  ;D . Its the job of a local media outlet to reflect local news. If the pieces being submitted by conservative councillors are newsworthy (or as newsworthy as anything gets here in Chickentown) - then, unless you're suggesting some sort of political oversight and censorship, they're bound to get featured, are they not?

Quote
There are more photos of Conservative Councillors in a weeks worth of SAdvers than in all the towns Tory election leaflets put together!

... which begs the question as to what the Labour councillors have been doing, eh? And if they HAVE been busy, it begs the question as to why they haven't been intelligent or wise enough to bother promoting what they're doing.

I'll repeat it for the third time just for final emphasis: The Adver will cover just about ANY story if someone has the brains to approach them with the detail. If you've got evidence that Labour stories are being actively suppressed, then go ahead, fill your boots and our eyes with the examples and I'll agree with you. Until then, you're merely highlighting the fact that the local Labour group are probably carrying on in their usual slightly inept and amateur fashion and their tribal followers are crying foul simply because the conservatives are much more professional about their use of PR.

In the meantime, I suggest that people wingeing about a bias risk simply betraying their own partisan wishes. The rest of the independent thinking people of Swindon probably find it rather amusing - as every fresh announcement and bit of puffery from the conservatives actually reminds everyone of the catalogue of previous over-blown claims that they've made - and will probably lose them as many votes as it wins.
I do not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it - [attributed to] Voltaire... 'Entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessita' - William of Occam.... 'You have a right to feel offended, but just cos you are offended doesn't mean you are right'

Offline Morsey

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 147
  • Hello !
Re: Have you recently stopped Buying the Pravdatiser
« Reply #35 on: March 12, 2012, 06:35:08 PM »
 :wink:You are funny, Toby ... fancy going to all that trouble to inform we minions that you are right, and we are of course, wrong! :banana: :tickedoff: :D :fence:

How are you finding my home town, by the way? (That'll get you going??) :surrender:

Offline Tobes

  • Regents
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 4951
Re: Have you recently stopped Buying the Pravdatiser
« Reply #36 on: March 12, 2012, 06:39:24 PM »
 ;D

I see, you're allowed to make a comment, but if its challenged, that's unfair?

 :coolsmiley:

Come on - this is a chat forum - one characterised by discussion and debate...  ::)

Quote
How are you finding my home town, by the way? (That'll get you going??)

Not a scooby what you're talking about  :laugh:
I do not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it - [attributed to] Voltaire... 'Entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessita' - William of Occam.... 'You have a right to feel offended, but just cos you are offended doesn't mean you are right'

Offline Rochelle

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 286
Re: Have you recently stopped Buying the Pravdatiser
« Reply #37 on: March 13, 2012, 08:21:38 AM »
I absolutely love local newspapers and still read the online versions for towns I've lived in ( my husband thinks I'm weird he may have a point).
In all honesty, the Adver is not really one of the better ones...
However, I think I have a reasonably good relationship with the local press, I have always had a positive response when I've taken a story to them and I do try to be helpful when they contact me. I have never been misquoted, so if I come across as a numpty it is my own fault.
There have been one or two occasions when something has been bumped and lo and behold a lovely big picture of one of our esteemed leaders has taken its place and once recently a journalist was asked by the editor to skew a story for a political purpose ( not one of mine but I can evidence this). To their credit the journalist wrote a fair and unbiased article and it was published.
I tend to concentrate on community stories which of course local papers love and I'm not particularly keen to use the media for overtly political purposes hence my healthy relationship with them I suppose.
Everyone knows dealing with the media can be a tricky business and it is natural to be wary, but it is part of the game these days...
I think it's worth mentioning that much of the work that is done in wards like mine is not newsworthy but it is nevertheless important to the people we are working for.
I'm not a policy-maker I'm a worker bee and spend a lot of my time dealing with complex casework of the kind which might not be as prevalent in more, how shall I say, well-heeled areas , it does not and should not make the papers.

Offline Morsey

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 147
  • Hello !
Re: Have you recently stopped Buying the Pravdatiser
« Reply #38 on: March 13, 2012, 09:35:11 AM »
Good comments, Rochelle, ground level work is vital to communities and needs to be discreet. There are many councillors of the ruling group who surely also do some of this kind of work, I expect each and every one of them to have half page promotionals about their excellent work amongst constituents prior to early May.

There is one problem, the SAdver will need to cut down on the size of piccies they print with each couple of paragraphs they print in praise and adulation for each one of the Conservative non-Cabinet, non-MP backbenchers or some important item will need to be 'bumped' to create space, surely?

The photo of Lawyer Buckland yesterday was so large it could have been cut out and put on the side of a number 13 bus!  Do the Tories supply both the propoganda and the photographs one muses?

Back to the story ... the paper was quite thin yesterday, but give it credit, there were more than ten pages worth a read ... keep it up! :banana:

Paul.

Offline helen thompson

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 68
  • Hello !
Re: Have you recently stopped Buying the Pravdatiser
« Reply #39 on: March 13, 2012, 05:29:29 PM »
Hi Muggins
yes thank you for reminding me of talk swindon.as for my post on the adver while yes i am labour i do think that it is still a tory rag,. i have read and delivered for the last 40 years the Adver,. plus i find it helpfull for news, but get fed up with non stop pictures of lib/dem or tory politicians and the collumns written by our leaders!.but as isaid before i also think the BBC is tory now so i am  not just biased against the Adver, i am in Oxford on a regualsr basisand the Adver;s sister paper the Oxford Mail is in general non political, so it is the editor not the paper.